So you can only charm mobs that con a perfect match or less. Hell even laughs would be better, but not death mobs. This is another hugely abused spell.
Commentator
Tweak charm person
So you can only charm mobs that con a perfect match or less. Hell even laughs would be better, but not death mobs. This is another hugely abused spell.
Scribe
While your at it, knock Dispel magic back down to something tolerable. Not "lol i make your class obsolete with one spell and a potion".
/not sarcasm
Edit: Edited for clarity of purpose.
Last edited by Kurix; December 9th, 2009 at 11:03 AM.
Commentator
I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not?
I think this is a very good idea, it still allows you to have an ally or two to help you fight but it stops people from having arch mage mobs kill themself for their gold, having their exp mobs do the same, or having Borlan kill people or tank for you. Charm is a great spell, it just needs to be lowered.
Scribe
charm person is kinda outrageous
Scribe
Theres only 2 arch mobs I can think of that are charmable... even then I've died to them often with charm or without. The lesser of the two mobs doesn't give gold to eff 45's and the greater is in a zone that makes fighting arch mobs complicated.Originally Posted by Anduin
I disagree completely with the charm complaint. People forget that for charm to be a powerful spell you have to be extremely high in level and you literally have to cast it at least 5,000 times. Zombies can be made that are just as strong as charmed mobs and charmed mobs have their limitations as well. Clerics get zombies that last twice as long and can easily be sanct. If an evil cleric can have such a great tank then a mage that cannot sanct their charmy deserves an equally strong tank, (that will only last a fraction of the time).
-menelaos
Scribe
You're kind of missing the point with the zombie arguement. You have to actually kill the mob to make a zombie dont you? Someone who is not even 30 mage can charm borlan. What is the cleric going to use to tank borlan in order to kill him and make his zombie?
Charm person has gotten completely out of hand, and if you disagree with that you might be delusional. Whether zombies are comparable would just mean that's also out of hand.
I've been pk'd by a mage who did less than 100hp dmg, while his giant mob did the other 400 in a couple rounds. I didnt attack him or the mob, it wasnt a tank it was a killing machine. Again, if a zombie can do this too, neither is right, and both should be lowered.
The charm complaint is completely valid. It is abused for pking, golding, exping, exloring.. what else is there?
God+
If you think it's bad now....
I remember when charm person worked on players. I really panicked when testing this with Hedonism. After he charmed me, he ordered me to "rem all" and it worked! I freaked out a little.
-Tokugawa
Commentator
I remember that happening to me too haha. Doesn't mean it doesn't need to be changed more though.
ps. -500 exp circlet!?!?!?
God+
Lol Paython charmed me once, no fun
Scribe
I do agree with charm person being out of hand. It's pretty ridiculous how big of a mob can be charmed. Zombies don't compare at all. Charm should be for perfect match or lower. That, at least, should be the case for mage mobs. A mage that knows the spell shouldn't be easily charmed by someone lesser.
Commentator
Wait, WHO can charm Borlan? I really don't see that being at all possible, without, say, use of a high level sphere...
...isn't this the 3rd or 4th thing someone's whined about that is more likely due to overpower of spheres rather than the spells themselves, as those with the spells seem to be more of the opinion that what people suggest isn't feasible...
-=SuicideMage=-
Commentator
Bels, you can charm Borlan just using the spell :P people do it all the time to tank mobs like Tharune. It's especially easy since he can't see invis so you cast, if it fails you jump, then re-try since he can't hit you while not fighting him. Only "downside" is you need a sanc on you to not get killed heh
God+
Should I give Borlan detect invis?
Commentator
Wouldn't make that big a difference, then instead of jump people would just flee and recast it when he enters the room. And Borlan is just 1 example.
God+
I was mostly kidding.
Commentator
Hrm...so maybe instead it should have something like teleport...where you jump/flee/otherwise and 'aren't composed enough to cast that yet...'
As well, Borlan is a big mob, but hardly the biggest out there, and I doubt the tactic would work for something that's TRULY nasty ((Ie, the few Uber AND Arch mobs....though Uber mobs are pretty badass in and of themselves (Awesome job Tamar, still loving them if I can't kill a one myself! :P) ...))
-=SuicideMage=-
Scribe
Borlan is by far a big enough mob to use as an example to show us that something is wrong. We're not trying to say you can use the spell to charm the most badass mob in the game, thankfully the charm spell DOES have some sort of limitations. At any point, Borlan IS a TRULY NASTY mob for almost anyone I would think. I sure as hell wouldnt want to get jumped by him by surprise.
This "arent composed enough to cast yet" idea sounds promising to me though. This could help the problem seeing as how you rarely charm a huge mob on your first attempt. But still, it shouldnt be possible to charm any mob that cons Death, at the very least.
Last edited by Grindel; December 17th, 2009 at 12:50 AM. Reason: Forgot to mention
Commentator
Why not? Just because it cons death doesn't mean you couldn't get that 1 in a thousand shot that you catch it unawares and defenses slacking...maybe the percentage should be lower on success, but it also depends on how big of a death it is...especially since it should really be a SOLO 30 mage that has the most charm power, and mobs that an eff 40 considers perfect match would be several levels above death to them...yet the other character, which is likewise a 30 mage, but with less focus into their class because they're multitasking their abilities, would be able to harm it rather easily...
...and that doesn't quite seem fair...
...though I ~am~ for giving Borlan detect invis, too...make people have to work really hard, or be really lucky to do it hehe.
....or charm person could have negative effects for the caster...something like 'Your spell goes horribly awry...' and suddenly, gee....where did your sanc go? Maybe not every cast, but as a side affect for trying to extenuate your charm for something much bigger than yourself...or more charming...
Be disarming, alarming, and not about farming....be charming!
-=SuicideMage=-
Scribe
Jumping removes you from combat weather you are invis or not. (mobs do not chase provided you have not previously fled from them). Addind detect invis to borlan will not accomplish what you are looking for. Mobs that are as big, swing as hard and hit as often as borlan could never be especially easy to charm. Though I will say... I have not yet attempted to charm him out of fear of being one rounded and looted.
As for Borlan being charmable, just make him uncharmable. There is a coding option and even an option in the area writer to make mobs uncharmable, many of the large mobs in the game are already uncharmable.
-Menelaos
Also ... I decided to test it myself. After 4 regens and 13 attempts I did land a charm on Borlan. lvl 64 mobs should not be easy to charm, and borlan was not easy to charm. It would be impossible for me to abuse him as a constant guard or PK tool. (since the duration of charm is not all that incredible and mobs need to be consistently recharmed). I would actually prefer to use a smaller mob as a tank because he only has 1500 hp and there are plenty of mobs with 1000 hp that I can charm much easier.
I still have to disagree, though I am obviously biased, being a mage (and a charm addict).
For those that see a mage pker walking around with borlan, my advice would be to avoid him for the next three minutes, and/or jump him when he is trying to recharm the monster.
Last edited by menelaos; December 18th, 2009 at 09:35 AM.
Commentator
This wasn't about Borlan at all, he was just used as an example. Also, imagine a d/a mage with sanc, they could probably get him in their first "regen" - especially if they're level 50.
And it's also not just abused for pk'ing but as you said, for tanking. I'm not against charm either - don't worry, what I'm proposing would still make exp incredibly easy for people like you :P
It should just work on mobs perfect match or lucky punk ones. Oh wait, I guess that might slow down your exp a bit... how people are against this makes a little more sense..
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